Zune.net
Started by khu at 11/26/2007 19:24:01. Topic has 26 replies.
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khu

Join Date: 11/13/2007 18:41:25

Posts: 295

11/26/2007 19:24:01
10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress

First, we all have to keep in mind what appears to be the design philosophy of the Zune experience.  Microsoft has created a handheld extension of your PC media library.  This is not an autonomous handheld media manager.  All things Zune flow from the perspective that your library resides in the Zune software and the device is just a way to take selected parts of it with you.  There is no management from the device itself and the software is designed to make your device match as closely as possible to your library.  Approaching the device and the library as two separate animals can cause a lot of frustration.  The Zune device is a shadow.  To make the shadow look the way it should, you really have to manage what is CAUSING the shadow.  That is a much different philosophy from many of the media players out there today.


Here are a few tips and tricks for keeping your Zune experience stress free.


1.  Fix all tags.  An app like the Zune software uses a lot of metadata to present your files to you.  Even though you may update various tracks, those updates do not always find their way into the tags.  As a result, when your metadata gets out of sync or if you decide to move or rebuild your collection, you can find some organization problems.  I recommend using a 3rd party program for finding your music information and tagging.  When the underlying tags are changed, those changes are reflected in your library.


For general tagging, a free program like mp3Tag will work very nicely.  It allows for batch tagging and renaming and will build tags based on the filename or build filenames based on the tags.  It will also give you a good view of your library for comparing the tags on various files.


For general library management, I use a program called MediaMonkey.  This program has a feature much like the old Find Album Info and will even embed the album art in the tag if possible.  This will ensure that when you put the file in another Collection or rescan it, the art will follow it.  You can also browse through possible matches much more quickly than the old software and the quality of many of the covers is very good.


Both of these are free.


2.  Do not make your Podcast directory a subdirectory of your monitored music folders.  If you rescan, there is a chance you will see your Podcast on both the Podcast and music tabs.  Keeping your Podcast directory outside of your Music directory also makes it easier to find the casts if you want to make changes, delete, etc.


3.  If you are going to make massive changes to your library, unplug the Zune.  While plugged in, changes that you make are synched immediately.  If you make a mistake, it will be much more difficult to recover if the Zune has been updated.  For example, an errant mouseclick deleted a double album for me.  However, I was able to copy it back to my computer from the Zune plugging it in, stopping the sync, and Copy to Collection.


When rebuilding my Collection, I dropped every monitored music folder.  I renamed directories, moved stuff around, and then finally added the new locations to monitoring.  The software made a note of what was already on my device and decided to sync only 45 tracks plus my Podcasts.  If I had done this with the Zune plugged in, it would have deleted 3300 tracks and then readded them.  Making massive changes while it was unplugged meant that it only had to sync the delta.


4.  Rip with an external program.  The Zune software is quite capable of ripping but you may often want a lot more control over the quality and size of your library.  In addition, ripping to a location the Zune software does not know about allows you to rip, update all tags, and THEN bring it into your collection.  It can be frustrating trying to correct tags with the Zune software so getting the information as accurate as possible beforehand is a plus.


Many now have some truly large Collections.  If you are using mp3 format, you might consider converting to a Variable Bit Rate.  The Zune will rip VBR as well as many other programs.  Personally, I like the quality of a 192bit VBR mp3.  I use Exact Audio Copy for ripping and LAME for encoding.


When ripping, I will normally have the Zune software running.  This will pull down all of the media information.  I usually cut and paste album info into the EAC gui and then rip.  I will then look at the files with Media Monkey and grab album art.  Once everything looks correct, I will copy the files into the Collection.  If things look good, delete from the rip location so I don't keep duplicates and go to the next one.


5.  Playlists.  Go to Settings --> Software -->  General and make note of the directory you set up as your Media folder.  New playlists will be created in a subdirectory called Playlist.  M3U playlists that you create with an external program can be dropped into this directory to be monitored.  If you are getting error messages that a particular playlist exists when you try to create a new one, check this directory and delete the old ones.


The playlists are in xml format and can be viewed with a text editor.  If you have playlists for files of one format and you have converted the files, you may be able to perform a simple search and replace to convert your old list to the new format.  This will prevent you from having to build it from scratch.


When you add a song to a playlist, it will automatically get synched to your device.  You can use this to manage what is on your device by a psuedo master list.  However, removing a file from the playlist does not delete it from the device.


6.  Video.  The native format for the Zune is wmv.  Whenever possible, convert to wmv prior to syncing.  Although the software will transcode multiple formats for you, that occurs during sync and you will have to wait on the device.  In addition, a copy of the transcoded file is not kept.  If you delete the video and add it later, it will transcode again.  The Zune will not transcode the following:


320x240 resolution 30fps 192bit 44kHz wmv.


I normally use the Windows Media Video 9 codec and Windows Media Video 10 Professional codec.  There are numerous apps that will convert from one format to another and see CucuSoft popping up on the boards quite a bit.  I personally use DVD Decrypter or DVD Shrink for ripping and AVS Video Converter for conversion.  Converting from an uncompressed format like VOB to WMV will happen almost in real time.  However, doing that prior to syncing means you aren't waiting for the software to do that conversion and then copy it.  In addition, you can keep the file for future use.  Typically, a feature film compress down to about a 400mb wmv.

 

7.  Podcasts.  The Podcast subscription is quite good but there are few quirks to work around.  As mentioned, place the Podcasts outside of your music library.  When going through the settings, you can control how many casts are on your HD as well as the Zune.  However, even when deleted from the Zune, they are still on your HD.


For each casts, you will see In Collection if it is on your computer and a Zune icon if it is on the Zune.  The download button overrides Series Settings and you can download specific Podcasts and they will be synched.  Automatic identifies files that were downloaded and synched automatically.  It is a good practice to occasionally examine the feeds and delete older files if you don't want them.


You can also sample Podcasts without subscribing.  Simply click the download button from the Marketplace and a file will be downloaded and synched.  You can always subscribe at a later date.


8.  Marketplace.  The Zune Marketplace is free to browse, sample, and subscribe to Podcasts.  All that is required is an account.  The Zune pass is an all-you-can-eat download service that provides unlimited downloads for a monthly fee.  However, you cannot burn those songs to a CD and not all tracks are available.  You can purchase with Microsoft Points and also get the rights to burn that song to a CD.  Points can be purchased online or at a brick and mortar shop like Best Buy.  Check the games section.  These are the same points used for Xbox Live.


To see what you have downloaded, go to the Marketplace and click on Downloads.  From here, you can see what you have downloaded with the Zune Pass, for Points, and active downloads.  If you bought music and need to download it again, do so from this screen.


9.  Wireless sync.  The wireless sync can work well but also has a few quirks.  This assumes you have set up the sync in the software with the device.  Typically, with the software running, plug in the device to an external power source like a dock or the travel charger.  Toggle on wireless.  After 60 seconds of being idle, the Zune will connect and begin to sync.


The wireless is automatically toggled off and disabled when the TV Out is toggled on.  When you undock or unplug it, the wireless will STILL be toggled off.  Remember to toggle it back on when you need it.


If plugged into external power and the wireless is enabled, it will continue to search for a network.  If the software is not running, it will simply continue to search.  If you cancel but leave the wireless toggled on, after 60 seconds it begins to search again.  If you do not want it to search, unplug it, undock it, toggle off the wireless, or toggle on the TV Out.


10.  General software problems and bugs.  If you are having problems running the software, check and make sure you have all of the necessary requirements.  The Zune software requires Windows XP Service Pack 2 or greater.  Even with all of the pre-reqs, you may have problems.  When posting, try to keep the following in mind:

  • A bug is something that is broken.  It is supposed to do "X" but does "Y" or kicks out an error.
  • A feature is functionality that is not present such as an Auto Playlist.
  • When reporting bugs, give as much information as possible.  For someone to be able to help you, they need to try to duplicate what you are doing.  For software issues, you should list the operating system and service packs, which part of the software is giving the problem, exactly what actions you were taking at the time, and how can the problem be duplicated.  If the Zune team can't reproduce it, they won't be able to fix it.

Microsoft Support Articles for Zune

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Join Date: 11/15/2007 01:12:43

Posts: 120

11/26/2007 20:04:01
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress

.. Bravo! Indeed, BRAVO!!

.. Here are several excellent suggestions to use when mired in some of the heartaches that Zune can create. From free software (always remember "caveat emptor - Buyer Beware!" when using freeware) to practical steps to use, this top 10 list is great.

.. I'd just add the Microsoft Support site to search out possible resolutions to problems you might encounter. It's a great resource!


Keep The Faith*
RoKuS
Original Brown 30

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Join Date: 12/2/2007 04:47:42

Posts: 8

12/3/2007 06:36:02
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
used media mokey worked great. but still getting one album with songs that shouldn't belong. example: nine inch nails- cowboy bebop. how do i fix this?
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Join Date: 11/13/2007 16:00:45

Posts: 466

12/3/2007 06:55:02
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
 GreyFox 00 wrote:
used media mokey worked great. but still getting one album with songs that shouldn't belong. example: nine inch nails- cowboy bebop. how do i fix this?


It's probably the album artists that is screwed up on it. Switch to list view and find that song/songs, then right click on the headings and click Choose Columns and check everything that has to do with artists and album.  Check to see that all that information is correct, if it not (which I'm going to guess is not and that's the cause of the mislabeling) you can either edit it there by right clicking and selecting "Edit" or use another taging program like mp3tag.

Hope that helps.

Oh Snap!

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khu

Join Date: 11/13/2007 18:41:25

Posts: 295

12/3/2007 13:52:09
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress

Ah, and now you have stumbled on an actual bug from what I can see.  In my experience, CT2049 is correct.  When I have had a problem in the past with songs not being recognized as valid media, repeated syncs and duplicates, replacing other songs in the library, etc., they have turned out to be the tags.

 

The Zune software has a problem with the format of some ID3 tags.  There are actually a number of ways to encode the ID3 v2 tags.  The software does fine with the tags in UTF-8 format but not so well with UTF-16 or the ISO format.  Mp3Tag will actually let you set the encoding and another user -- WillysJeepMan -- determined it was not just the tags but the encoding of the tags.

 

I came across another post which stated that for the UTF-8 version of the ID3 tags, Album Artist is not included.  However, the Zune software reads Album Artist as part of its organization.  I haven't looked at the specs or whitepaper for ID3 tags (not nearly that bored on vacation) but that seems to reflect what I can see.

 

A couple of nights ago, I ripped a few CDs -- one of which was a compliation (soundtrack).  I had to spend quite a bit of time to finally get them working for me.  The Zune software does not have problems with the v2 tags 100% of the time even if not in UTF-8 so for this one particular album, I skipped the mp3Tag save and finally got it organized correctly.  Still, I seemed to go back and forth between one album for every track to Invalid Media to not all tracks being imported.  That one particular CD was a real pain but I eventually got it to work.  Since a lot of this stuff seems to be done late at night for me, it could have been as much being tired and sloppy as just the general wonkiness we see with the Zune and tagging.  Just stick with it.  Not real useful I know but...

 

If you save in mp3Tag and find that you are getting one album per track, you might want to skip mp3Tag for those tracks or try to make it work with one of the other formats for the v2 tags.

 

I haven't quite figured out the trick yet for the other encoded formats.  I know that at times, the software can read them correctly because I have several compliations in my collection.  Although I can't tell you exactly how to repeat it, I can only say you will eventually be able to get it to work -- especially if you approach in a fairly deliberate fashion.

 

EDIT:  You might also try Windows Media Player.  I came across a comment about that after I had finished my exercise with the CD.  I believe you can drag one track to another and WMP will prompt you to put them in the same album.


Microsoft Support Articles for Zune

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Join Date: 11/14/2007 14:10:30

Posts: 13

12/3/2007 14:39:20
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
WOW, thanks for taking the time to create this entry.  Very helpful!!!

Tony Rocha Rockin' a brown Zune

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12/3/2007 21:06:12
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
You could also note that setting everything to manual sync relieves alot of stress.  Nothing happens unless you tell it to.  I have enough space on my 30gb to justify making it all automatic but sometimes there are just albums i don't want on my zune popping up on shuffle.  It makes everything easier just manually doing everything.
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Join Date: 12/2/2007 04:47:42

Posts: 8

12/4/2007 02:02:05
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
Its not the tags. i think  its the program. I change it but it wont accept, or it changes it back immediatly after i hit enter. i have the correct info in windows explorer. thisis really irriatating me. can anyone help?
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Join Date: 11/23/2007 01:22:30

Posts: 180

12/5/2007 09:03:01
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
Pardon my asking, but why do we have to install mp3Tag to edit the tag information when we can do that in Windows Explorer by right-clicking the file, hitting properties, clicking the Summary tab and entering in the information ourselves?

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http://forums.zune.net/1/154830/ShowPost.aspx#154830

http://www.last.fm/user/Hevroth/

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khu

Join Date: 11/13/2007 18:41:25

Posts: 295

12/5/2007 13:47:57
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress

You really don't have to use mp3Tag but it has a lot of advantages:

 

  • Provides a report-like view of tags for comparison
  • Displays the number of pictures used in album art and shows if tracks all have the same art or not
  • Allows deleting of album art
  • Allows lookup of album info
  • Allows extended tag editing (including Album Artists which is not exposed in Explorer.  Explorer doesn't expose all tags)
  • Allows for saving tags in a specific format
  • Allows for removing the ID3 tags if necessary
  • Allows auto-numbering if you are creating a "custom" album from various tracks

 

For me, it is the ease of use.  When you select multiple files in Explorer and go to Properties, if values differ, you have to view properties on each file to find the one with the different value.  That type of troubleshooting is much easier with a report.  Also, I don't believe you can view Album Art through Explorer so you cannot see if all tracks have the same art or if some tracks have more/less art than others.  I have run into problems in the past where one track of an album had different art and it affected the sorting and grouping (that was in version 1).


Microsoft Support Articles for Zune

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Join Date: 11/23/2007 01:22:30

Posts: 180

12/5/2007 16:36:22
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress
 khu wrote:
Displays the number of pictures used in album art and shows if tracks all have the same art or not

You cannot see if all tracks have the same art or if some tracks have more/less art than others.

What do you mean "more" art than others?  Is it possible for a track to have more than one album art?  What does it do when you're playing the track on your Zune, does it cycle through the art while playing the song or what?


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http://www.last.fm/user/Hevroth/

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khu

Join Date: 11/13/2007 18:41:25

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12/5/2007 16:45:47
re: 10 Tips for dropping level of Zune related stress

I believe the tags allow for you to set an image for the cover, rear, insert, etc.  Typically, we think of Album Art as the cover but you can actually have multiple pictures.  The Zune software only displays one picture for the cover.  Not quite sure how it decides which picture to use...and thus the problems with mismatched art on an album.

 

In the previous version of the software, when you viewed the extended tags, you could switch to the Art tab and see all of the images and for what purpose they were tagged (cover, rear, insert, etc.).  You can also see this with MediaMonkey.  Mp3 tag gives a count (1/2 meaning one of two) or something like "Multiple" if the images across all selected tracks do not match.  I am at work and can't remember the exact wording...but it does give you some feedback on whether or not all of the images match.

 

The Zune and the software only display the cover.  However, I believe it is aware of the other art and that is what can occasionally cause grouping and sorting problems.  After all, if two tracks have different covers, why would they be in the same album even if tagged with the same Album Title?  That was the question the software always seemed to "ask" in the past and the answer was usually to kick that errant track out into its own album.

 

Once I was able to see that the album art could cause sorting problems, it is now a practice of mine to remove all images save one when I come across it.


Microsoft Support Articles for Zune

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