Mr BoPeep wrote:
luckado wrote:
Why can't people sing about life, love, relationships, problems, struggles, etc.... isn't that what the book of Psalms is?
I love the fact that the lines are finally starting to blur a little between "Christian" & "Secular" music as it used to be called... I think music should be called "music," and not labeled something that would turn the world off to it... just because the Word says that we should not be "of" the world, doesn't mean that we're not "in" it... more appropriate labels are Rock, Rap, Jazz, etc... I have to say that I've always been turned off by the label "CCM" or contemporary Christian music... usually if it has that label, I don't want to hear it... even Rich Mullins hated that label...
Like you, I grew up listening to Christian music only. It was a household rule and it worked fine. A few years ago, I began to believe that there was nothing wrong with listening to groups that vaguely imply a Christian theme. As time progressed, I found that there was nothing wrong with listening to "Christians in a band", but didn't sing necessarily about the Lord. More time passed, I listenend to clean secular music that was about love, relationships, and life. Then, my music selection continued down the spiral away from praising the Lord to music that was about hate, death, sex, blood, and violence. Thank the Lord, He convicted me, brought me to repentance and away from that. I still feel the pull to the secular, but I'm reminded of this spiral. I still have to keep myself in check. I like groups like Anberlin and P.O.D., but they walk a very line in my book that almost pushes me to stop listening to them.
I would say Rich Mullins hated the CCM label because he viewed it as a compromiser. His lyrics cannot be compared to any secular artist out there. He was deeply in love with Lord and had a great heart for missions. The CCM is just a money-making business.
I think the "blur" you speak of will not only make Christian music indistinguishable from the world, but also Christians. Followers of Christ need to be holy, which is to be set apart. I think there needs to be that distinction that makes us different from the world in nearly every respect. The world will always be turned off by Christ and Him crucified. I'll close with John 15:19 which says, "If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you."
I think this discussion goes beyond the simple differences between "Christian" and "non-Christian" music...
All people have their weaknesses; for example, some people struggle with drinking... some Christians can have a glass of wine for dinner (and not affect their lives or ministry), where others really struggle with alcoholism, and have to completely stay away from even one drop... I would say my weakness is food... the Bible calls it gluttony. I have to watch what I eat, because I can easily fall into the trap of overeating and making myself sick from eating too much. That is definitely an area I struggle with. In the past I have had to really train my body into refusing to eat too much, even when I'm not hungry...
However, when it comes to music, I do not struggle there. I am a musician (drummer in my church band), and do not have the problem of music affecting me and my walk with God. When I listen to music, I don't find myself drawn to the dark stuff, or the music you were talking about... music about "hate, death, sex, blood and violence." It just doesn't appeal to me... never has, never will... when it comes to the hard type of music (hardcore, metal, etc.), I always find myself searching for the more positive message type groups... examples would be Demon Hunter, Underoath, Destroy the Runner, etc... too numerous to list here... I've never been drawn to groups like Metallica, Tool, Slayer, etc... in fact, if you own Guitar Hero 3, you know that there are a few pretty dark songs there at the end of the list, like a Slayer song, an Iron Maiden song... just stuff I have no desire to listen to. So I don't even play those songs.
Anyway, my point is, that is something you struggled with, but something that I don't struggle with, and never have. I'm glad you are striving to walk away from music like that, and it seems like you are really putting that area of your life in God's hands, which is awesome!
When I say that I welcome the "blur" between secular & Christian music, I guess I forget that there are people out there that really struggle in this area, and are really drawn away from their walk with God when they start dabbling in that extreme, dark message that you mentioned. I'm glad that there is a section of music out there labeled "CCM" or "Christian" for those like you that need to have that distinction... I guess for people like me, and most Christians I know, music just doesn't affect them that way. Most of the Christians I know can listen to secular music, and not be affected by it in that way... and don't be confused here, I'm not talking about the "death, sex, and violence" music, I'm talking about that in between music... music that I referenced in my first post... music about life, love, relationships, problems, struggles, etc...
geboRedeemed wrote:
This is a little off topic, but oh well. As the age old saying goes it doesn't really matter what you call it but what it is. If music is written for God's glory then it will be "Christian" music despite what you call it. And if the lyrics are pleasing to God than people either listen to it or they won't based on their beliefs and tastes regardless of what label is put on it. You can't honestly believe that more lost people would have listened to Rich Mullins music if it was labelled easy listening instead of CCM. Darkness hates the light and if the music shines true light then the world WILL hate it. Blurry lines and grey areas are not the way to preach the Gospel or Glorify God, two things we are commanded to do in the Bible. Those commands also apply to "Christian bands" and "Christians in a band". I still refer to music as Christian and secular and feel that the lines are really only blurring with those artists who appear not to put Christ first. I say appear because I can't know their heart or their motivation, but I can decide not to listen to their music. When all is said and done we'll all be accountable for our actions. If someone has squandered their ministry, whether it be music or one on one relationships, we'll give an account.
To respond to your post geboRedeemed, of course non-believers aren't going to seek out "Christian" music, such as Rich Mullins, etc. Which is the exact point I was trying to make. Until Christians bands & artists can go out, get signed to a secular label, and not be confined to the "Christian" section of the CD rack or MP3 selection, non-believers aren't going to listen to it. When it comes to reaching out to the lost, what good does that do?
That's where my point about the line between the "Christian" and "Secular" styles of music getting blurred makes sense. I love the fact that there are Christians that are finally getting signed to secular labels, and going out there in the world (not necessarily being "of" it), and putting out their message about how much God loves them... and not necessarily in the lyrics, but in the way their actions, and how they talk to non-Christians once they become fans of their music.
People blast this idealogy all the time... think that we should stay in our little Christian "bubble" (read: comfort zone), and never venture out into the world and "preach the gospel to every creature." Look at Jesus... who was He hanging out with? Did he stay in the synagogue from age 12 until the time he was crucified? Of course not... he wouldn't have been crucified if He had stayed there... He was crucified because He went out to where the world lived... spent time with them... gave them hope... gave them salvation.
So I guess my overall goal here is to convey my opinion that, for people like me, there is no need for a "Christian" music section... if you want praise & worship music, that's great... I love great praise & worship music like the rest of you! And if there were no "Christian" music section in the store, I don't think any of us would have any problems finding it... today with the advent of the Internet, MP3 players, etc. (isn't that why we're here on this website?? LOL) we can find any kind of music we want, without having to go to a particular section to find it...
Mr BoPeep made the point that "the 'blur' I speak of will not only make Christian music indistinguishable from the world, but also Christians." I think you are selling you and other Christians way short here... with the Internet, wikipedia, websites, etc... you can find out what's Christian and what's not just by doing a small bit of research on the artist or group.
You are right... you said "Followers of Christ need to be holy, which is to be set apart." But that goes way beyond what kind of music you listen to... that speaks of how you live your life toward God and others every day. You said that you think there needs to be that distinction that makes us different from the world in nearly every respect. That type of statement is way bigger than what music you listen to... it has everything to with how you live your life... walking in love toward others, walking like Jesus did.
I'll just reiterate that I love the fact that there are groups out there signing on with secular labels, and getting that same message out there to the world... the world that wouldn't otherwise listen to their music if they were confined to the Christian section...
Thanks for reading.
